Darkening system.....15 minute advantage????
The Discussion Centre: Training & Loft Management: Darkening system.....15 minute advantage????
I was up visiting my friend who helped me get started and as always he reminded me that he would/will have a 15 minute advantage on me because he uses the darkening system. I don't want to start an argument about that statement, but what I would like to know is why? If what I understand is correct they moult their body feathers......how does that make them faster? Just curious.
Termite
He's dreaming Termite, don't worry about it you'll be there.
You know... and this applies to all and sundry. Thesis's and systems are used where all can / are of benefit, but spare time and thought and dwell on this thought! Provided certain habits are retained and stuck to nigh rigidly, wouldn't many of the same ones, Top fanciers still be there about every week just the same...? Isn't it that they are more mindful, observant, even dedicated, yes doing regimentally the rigours many of us 'By Pass' when it don't suit etc. or time is of the essence? I think one needs to look more at the Fancier than A The 'Pigeons' and B. What system. or the fundemental of the systems used!
Hi Termite. Roly and Bob have it wrong and your friend is in part correct. While the essence of what Roly is saying is quite correct, it does not apply in the case of young bird systems flying under some conditions. As an example, for Billy T. or the fanciers in Florida or Australia racing in the winter, the systems lose much of their effect, but in the conditions that you and I race in, the systems make all the difference. To prove the point, look back at the results in the late 80's and early 90's when the systems were just starting to gain popularity in this part of the world. The first few lofts that caught on and applied the systems correctly were dominating the results like never before. First 30 club and combine by 15 plus minutes. Once the rest of the keen fanciers caught up to speed and started using the systems, the results returned to a more balanced spread between various lofts at the top of the sheet.
What the systems do is force the birds to mature faster by speeding up the hormone changes within the body of the bird. This in turn allows the motivational systems (widowhood or nest condition) to work. It also makes the birds bigger and stronger physically and ensures they have a full set of both body and flight feathers for all the races.
Your friend has pulled an arbitary number of 15 minutes out of the air, but he is correct in that in our part of the world, flying our type of schedule, natural moult birds competeing against birds on a system is like boys against men. The boys may get luck now and then, but in the final analysis, it is not even close. Those that tell you the systems don't give this kind of advantage are wishful thinkers that don't want to do the work of the systems and wish everyone else would stop.
I agree Mike but let's let the kid walk before asking him to run????
We use both systems in the valley and they produce about the same results, there is no dominating system here including widowhood and all the variations on it. But A regimental celebate routine also produces excellent results.
Thanks,
I figured that there was something to it or why would anyone do the extra. I was just wondering why. Mike, your explanation is great and makes sense to me.
Roly and Bob,
I know what you are saying too....I'm good with any results this year. Heck, I'll be happy if I have birds left to race next year 
So does that mean that the system is just used for young birds? I don't know why but I think I want to concentrate on OB widowhood and not work the YB's so hard the first year....time will tell.
Termite
Termite, you may put a hurt on this 15 minute champion. Dont send any bird to the race with a missing flight. Watch the weather also. If rain is forecast or headwinds. Send the limit. Make sure your birds are well conditioned. Baby feathers are not as strong as your moulted out culls. You may put a kink in this braggards toupee. Hope so. Lets race. Bye BillyT
Termite. The light and dark systems only apply to young birds. Personally I find old bird widowhood flying the most enjoyable aspect of this hobby. As such, my young bird racing is strictly for schooling the birds to prepare them for their future spot on the widowhood team. My experience tells me that going easy on the youngsters makes them better old birds. That does not mean cuddling them, or not racing them, they need to be fully prepared and experience is by far the best teacher. My goal is to find the balance between getting that experience without breaking them down physically or mentally. I am not sure why Billy would advise you to ship the limit when rain is forecast. One smash and you could find yourself right back at square one. Even with my years in the hobby and the depth in my old bird team and breeding loft, I still try to err on the side of caution with my young birds. Slow and steady works for me, but to each his own.
Also, that is not to say that good well prepare youngsters flying on the nature light cycle can't post some impressive results. They are fully capable of winning on their day. The systems come into play for such things as loft point championships and overall average speeds and big money open races at the distance late in the season when the natural light birds are half bald and dropping their 8th, 9th and 10th flights.
Bob F. I take your point. I was only concerned that Termite might learn some bad habits along the way that will be hard to break later. I should have made it more clear that I was not recommending that he try and use the systems himself right off the bat, only that he be aware of their potential and that if he one day wants to really go for it in young birds, the systems will be a must.
My point is that the moulted out YB has feathers that should withstand the elements. I am not sure the baby feathers can. Not an expert, but would take my chances with them in the head winds and rain. Who knows? Lets race. Bye BillyT
You know I found the last posts very interesting,indeed moreso, may I add, than I have for sometime.
And Termite I will stand corrected via MikeV and say that the Light or Dark system in y/b's can, will and do help. But more of thatin a moment. Firstly let me say two things. One I had a y/b drop in towards back end of last season... it's wing condition etc. in regards of racing, was first class! Surely a big advantage to a depleted wing I would have thought (if it had homed lol). So indeed it may well be so. I was impressed and thought 'I'll have mine like that next season'.
But there is another line of thought here too!
One to do with that great provider and teacher, and her why's and how fores! When a bird is in moult it's fitness is way above those that aren'! Nature sees to that for many , and mostly obvious reasons. She provides and does everything for a reason. Nothing, but nothing is ever left to chance, and every thing is compensated for! I'd wager that a fit bird in condition with a full wing, on either the light or dark system, will not be any where near as fit as a bird that is growing it's wing flights, or in moult! Again the actual flight number and when it was thrown need also to be taken into consideration. I'll stick at the moment with the thoughts on Y/B's as Old birds again is a different ball game. And I'll wager that those that use to win, will win, They will anyway whatever system they use. If they are racing Y/B'S and conserving their enigises and also watching the Flight droppings, they will take all the beating, indeed I'll go further and say that a equal bird(s) in equal hands the moulting one wins... Yes because the Knowleagdeable fancier is watchng, observing and ultilising! But again the point I am making is simply many have so - called moved on... Hence many of the BETTER fanciers are using the Light / dark system. But it is easier, and lazier and falls into a system readily..... And not neccessarily better!
Another point I would argue streneously with MikeV about is the view that Light or Dark system only work for Y/B's. this is completely and utterly untrue, and I'd certainly recommend it for old birds in various systems and not least with hens. The benefits are collosal!
Well Roly you have me on that one. I only know of the use of what we call the light and dark system to munipulate the moult and hasen the maturity of the youngsters. Since old birds are already mature and are not racing, at least in these parts, during the moult, I have no idea how or why one would use them on old birds.