Hi, I have never raced pigeons before, but I will be this yb season. I have a few questions about feeding and exercising youngbirds.

Is it better to feed them once or twice a day? and how much should you feed them each time? Also, how many times a day should I exercise them? Should I feed them right after I exercise them? I don't yet have any youngbirds, but I will in a few weeks.

Thanks,
Bryan

By Roly on Thursday, March 07, 2002 - 02:53 pm: Edit

Feed can be used to control your birds. IE a chuck in the morning and light fed in. Excerised at night and fed in. No more than a ounce and a half a day if pretty active. MEAN lean and ready to run. Of course feeds can vary in their wieght.
IE peas/ beans, graind etc.
How you make sure they all receive the 11/2 ounces is upto you. But be careful of that crap notion of 'I chuck it in and if they don't trap fast enough they don't get their share' That's true.. but then others over eat and trap slower next time etc. And that is an forever ongoing thing. I suggest that a whistle / rattle be used to get them to know it's feed time .... not rattling the food tin .... and when they are lining up open up! A little on clean floor, then adding till the first ones move away. Don't leave any food about. Or in hopper boxes the same. AND clean water is very important too at feed time. If exercised well they will soon puff up and settle for the night. Same again next day. A habit will soon form. Be if you can as regular as clockwork with times. If they are free flying when you wish to feed them in..... leave them a little longer. Remember that as soon as they see you - with the habit - they will start to drop.
Morning feed in need only be 1/2 ounce. ounce at night. Some feed just the ounce a day... I think as they are still growing -and working - more is needed.

By Sarmy on Thursday, March 07, 2002 - 05:03 pm: Edit

Bryan, Congrats on getting into flying pigeons, your gonna Luv it, I am also a new flyer who has flown one YB season and am currently preparing for week four of our OB season,I have also foud this to be an excellent place to learn from guys who have been doing this a long time.I also tend to trust them more because I`m not flying against any of them. I feed my YB`s twice a day,I think it is important that they recieve the propper amount of nurishment while they are growing.I also have an angled screen hatch type door over half my landing board that is closed and latched when I`m not fling or racing them, When they start flying and are all outside, I also shut the hatch and keep them out for an hour or so to fly around the lake or just back in forth between lofts, Then I shake the can and feed them wait til there fairly excited and open the hatch and they all trap at ounce and if one or two don`t make it in to eat then they don`t eat that night next day they improve on there trapping skills, trust me! And when they start excersising it keeps them from comming down early to eat.I watch them fly by and look to see if the hatch is open and as they get older they will fly til you open the hatch and then they will all or most come down at ounce, Anyways I`m starting to ramble on a bit here,the best advice I can give you is that I think you can learn from a lot different recources you just have to sort through it and see what gonna work best for you! Sarmy

By Ron on Saturday, March 09, 2002 - 12:46 am: Edit

Hi all. In the hot weather and high humid [average temperature is about 36 Celsius degree all day, 25 Celsius degree at night], would it possible to do something to stop or at least delay the moult of young birds? Here my birds usually start to drop their primary flights at four months old, sometimes sooner. There will be some big races [similar to your combine] on the second week of April, and I really do not want to miss such an event just because of my birds' moulting. There are some young birds in my loft, those are proving themselves among the best, often beat others when training, starting to pair up [a sure sign of beginning to moult, in my limited experience]. Local guy suggested that 1. pull out all the primary flights so the bird will complete the moult faster, or 2. feed them less than normal, i.e 20 grams [0.7 ounce] per bird, and split to four times. That way the birds will stop the moult because the lack of food. I am getting confused... both ways seem not doing any good to my birds' performance, with 1. birds cannot fly means cannot train, with 2. not enough food means losing form. What say yours? Thanks and have fun.

By Bshuba on Saturday, March 09, 2002 - 11:58 am: Edit

Darking system...8hrs of light.

By Billytaylor on Saturday, March 09, 2002 - 12:31 pm: Edit

Cutting 9th and 10th down to about an inch of the base, then pulling them a week later has to be done at least 3 months before racing to work. Why not just breed earlier and use light system or later and use darkening system. You are headed for trouble not feeding the babies enough. They need normal grouth to be any good in both YB and OB racing. I think you are worrying about flights when all you have to do is look before putting them in a race. Why make this sport too hard. It is designed for idiots, the birds do all the flying. Why not just keep them healthy and conditioned and stand back and enjoy racing? My thoughts. Lets race. Bye Bily

By Davidtichbourne on Monday, April 22, 2002 - 07:33 pm: Edit

I let my YBs out at 7:15am today like I do everyday, 3 of 15 them stayed out all day.

I saw most of them flying from about 7:20am to 8:00am, but then I had to go off to a business meeting for the morning. Most were probably back in the loft by 9am, and eating their morning meal.

Of the 3 that stayed out, 1 dropped out of the sky at about 4:30 and back thru the trap in a few seconds. The last where still out at 7pm, I saw them flying over the house at 5:30pm, at least they are still in the area as I had hoped. They might stay out overnight, (as one of the two did this before, I named him "Splat").

Today, nothing spooked the birds that I know of, but I am wondering if I am feeding them too much or something...I feed them Young Bird Base Racer seed mix (a good canadian product)...and a handful of popcorn at each meal

Do you fellows let your YBs eat twice a day? Do you let them eat their fill, I notice mine don't quite finish all their food, so they seem to "cherry pick" the seeds they eat.

Also do you let your YBs fly twice a day? I don't think I will, because I don't want to disturb my neighbors ...around supper time is when folks in my city neighborhood get home from work.

Later,//Thanks
Dave.

By Tommakowecki on Monday, April 22, 2002 - 07:55 pm: Edit

I know I am feeding too much if - the yb's leave some....unless a bit of barley. Out once a day for them is all they need and seems easier to control them.

By Davidtichbourne on Monday, April 22, 2002 - 08:08 pm: Edit

Thanks, I will wean them off the twice a day feeding. Most of the birds are very, very tame, so I thought maybe I was doing okay, now I realize the birds are just smarter than me, and they are just pretending to be tame to pig out...

2 of the 3 birds are back in now...I am sure the last little fellow will be back tomorrow (my birds have a way of getting the neighborhood all the neighbor pigeons to join in their morning flight). This was the first time he was out ranging, and of course he was my favorite red checker!

later,
Dave.

By Billytaylor on Monday, April 22, 2002 - 09:36 pm: Edit

David Tish, Until you start training down the road, once a day out of the loft is enough. Feed the YBs once a day after their evening fly. Use about 1/2 barley to gage if you are feeding then enough. If they leave the barley, feed less, if they eat all the barley and are still hungry, feed more. Lets not make a rocket scientist study of this. Of course when you start roading, decrease the barley, feed more, but control trapping by feed. My thoughts only. Lets race. Bye Billy

By Davidtichbourne on Monday, April 22, 2002 - 10:15 pm: Edit

Thanks Billy, I will give this a try tomorrow.

By Mreyesign on Tuesday, April 23, 2002 - 12:17 am: Edit

To Ron and Titch. Believe this or not but, most guy's do their birds harm by OVERFEEDING than underfeeding. Most family pet's are killed by owners who think that because the animal is still hungry, it should get more. WRONG. Ask any Vet worth his salt and he will tell you that the average family pet is killed by what we think is kindness. The same applies to our birds. Overfeeding kills a team quicker than most things. Your birds should "ALWAY'S" be ready to eat something. Didn't you ever notice that, Fit birds eat very little compared to un-fit ones. Champions never get sick and, never gorge themselves. If you feed your birds all at once, as soon as the first one goes for a drink, take the feed away and don't listen to this crap about some eating faster than others. Let the slow ones learn to eat faster. Why screw up the entire team for the sake of one or two that eat slower than the rest. If you have doubts about what Iam saying, go back and check them out about one hour after the feed and see how full they are. True story. Just about everything you want your birds to do right, is tought by the use of food and the same applies to all other animals and birds. It is your most valuable tool if you know how to use it correctly. I was once told by an old guy, to "get the birds fit in the loft" but, like all young know it all's at the time, I laughed. I was wrong. Very wrong. It can be done if you know how, and the secret is in the feeding. You want your birds to fly for a long time each morning? Then let them eat all they want the night before. But, you won't win on the next week end with them.??????

By Roly on Tuesday, April 23, 2002 - 12:59 am: Edit

I think Bob that the 'Laboudor dog is the finest examole of over feeding. Most people have the thought that they should be rolly polly and fattish. This of cause is not so. But the will be 'Sick' and resume to gorge them selves... Same as birds need to be lean, mean. and ready to run!

By Bas on Tuesday, April 23, 2002 - 04:42 am: Edit

Davidtich, For what it is worth, mine have been erratic of late. Power out of a morning and fly strong. Come back, do endless circuits. Kinda trap well. Afternoons, anything can happen. Sometimes kit up but mostly lope around at tree top height. Mainly just frig about. Pisses me off but I figure it is exercise. I get the idea that they are bored. A month or so back I knew I was overfeeding them. Young, growing etc. But it got to the stage that after tem minutes they would land. Maybe take off. Maybe walk around the roof. Little gullets hammering away. Clearly out of condition. So listening to these other guys I trimmed back the feed and the change in a few days was dramatic. But they started to moult so dummy upped the peas. Seemed to throw them all out again. Back to normal again now on a store bought pigeon mix. Fair bit of wheat and barley. These guys will correct me if I wrong but there seems to be a very,very fine line between too little and too much. I'm now starting to weigh each meal to see where I am. Feed more at night and very little in the mornings.
Enjoyed your page with the links regarding the satellite tracking.

By David on Tuesday, April 23, 2002 - 06:59 am: Edit

ITS all about feeding and flight. have know many over the years that leave a full hopper of grains 24 hrs a day. they also trainned 60 plus miles everyday rain or shine. put it on take it off bottom line is lean and mean win. oh untill we hit a smash and that winner probably carrys a bit more weight he just had a little more to give think. just as bob stated most kill with kindness when it comes to over feeding. just look at our youth over all. fat fat and more fatwe wont look at us older folks as for the moment we aint talking about us

By Terryh on Tuesday, April 23, 2002 - 11:56 am: Edit

Last week in this area 28C, but yesterday it snowed all day and 0C. I find this really affects the appetite of the birds. When it gets abnormally cold, the birds appetite will increase as it would, as they prepare for winter. Natures way of preparing them for winter. Birds that were flying 45 min last week, were constantly trying to get in loft this week after 5 minutes. Find it difficult this time of year to get feeds adjusted, with changing temperatures. I also, suppliment my YB mix with about 50% barley at this time.
4th week of retirement. Fly birds twice a day starting @ 06:30. 3 different teams including YB's. Interesting life change. Leaking gas line on training car $30.00, Transmission solenoid replaced $200.00. Oh yes, you need a brake job $200.00(including rotors of course). Went to Ottawa yesterday for feed. Took short cut home through Limerick Forest(gravel road), and removed muffler. Should be good for at least $100.00.
Conclusion: Retirement could prove to be expensive and time consuming. How in heck, did I ever find time to go to work 5 days per week? Birds are serving their purpose. Something to get up to each AM.

Best Terry

By Roly on Tuesday, April 23, 2002 - 12:04 pm: Edit

If one hopper feeds it is pretty effective. The birds only tend to take what is sufficent as they are not worried that it will soon disappear.
Some feed a little at a time by hand till the first one or two go to perch. This can back fire if you don't know where they ALL are all the time of feeding... some eat quicker than others too.
Individually is great if you have the time and patience I reckon.

By Bill on Tuesday, April 23, 2002 - 01:15 pm: Edit

Hi Terry H....With all your money terry why worry a mear spit in the bucket so to speak, Any way how are you doing my friend have not talked to you for a while best of luck terry. bill butterfield

By Bill on Tuesday, April 23, 2002 - 01:17 pm: Edit

Hello David R. Will be up in your neck of the woods on sunday let me know if the tea is on. bill butterfield

By Terryh on Tuesday, April 23, 2002 - 01:34 pm: Edit

Thanks for Best Wishes Bill. Am doing well. Keeping very busy, so I haven't been on here much lately. Enjoying the extra time I have, with birds. Big change from previous 25 year, where I tried to work and fly birds. Hope performance reflects time this year.
Best Terry

By Davidtichbourne on Tuesday, April 23, 2002 - 01:49 pm: Edit

Thanks everyone for the feeding tips!!

I started cutting back today, and birds trapped great after an hour out, (all where flying, except for one pet (named "Dr. Cull") and two really young ones).

I got the gang trapped on a tiny handfull of seed barley, wheat and peas but then a gol dang starling came in my loft and it couldn't figure out how to get out, I opened the trap and three "fed" birds went out and dissappeared, probably for the day...so I will feed normal mix this afternoon and give it a go again tomorrow...the fun never stops.

Dave.

By Davidtichbourne on Tuesday, April 23, 2002 - 08:57 pm: Edit

Bas,
Thanks for checking out my website, I am in the middle of updating the site, and those links on Ed Lisi's Satellite Tracking were sent to me by Tom Makowecki, I like the tracking part, but as far as the magnetite experiment goes, I truly believe a pigeon on a normal diet with good grit etc will have enough iron in their system for any specialized biological compass that may need to develop in a young bird, (Magnetite or whatever the fellow was feeding is just a form of iron). This type of experiment would need to be done on a few hundred birds in a "double blind" fashion for me to be comfy with the conclusion.

I found the satellite tracking experiment facinating because it provided consise data of a bird's where-abouts most of the way home.

I have a list of lots more pigeon navigation studies and I will post those links someday too.

I am looking for a Scentific American article which talked about pigeon navigation and their little network of specialized nerve cells which permit birds to use the earth's magnetic field to navigate...if anybody can point me to it I think the study was done and the article was published in Scentific American in the 1974-1982 period, I think...

later,
Dave.

By David on Wednesday, April 24, 2002 - 04:25 am: Edit

BILL BUTTERFIELD. read you e mail and give me a time.

By Bill on Wednesday, April 24, 2002 - 12:47 pm: Edit

Hello Dave R...Weather permiting about 9.00 am. Do you know john pifher he got one of my young birds at the auction so maybe i can bring it with me and he can pick it up just a thought. bill butterfield.

By David on Wednesday, April 24, 2002 - 06:31 pm: Edit

HI BILL B. yes me know fatty phiffer for 30 years will call him to pick up the young bird at my place sunday. thats done.

By Bas on Wednesday, April 24, 2002 - 07:12 pm: Edit

Davidtichbourne. Hi. How is the feeding regime going? Bet gold to goose shit they are shaping up. Beloved Bums are taut,tight terriffic. If you can email me an address, I will fire a National Geographic up to you. Reasonable article on bird navigation. Vol.156 No2. August 1979. Covers the subjects on the Alberta Classic site dealing with navigation. May provide names/leads to more recent material.......Bas

By Mreyesign on Wednesday, April 24, 2002 - 07:26 pm: Edit

Talking about navigation. Mike V. What ever happened to the booklet I sent you that you were going to post for everyone to see???????

By Mikev on Wednesday, April 24, 2002 - 09:51 pm: Edit

Hi Bob. I am still working on it. The problem is the diagrams and maps. I can't type them in and they really add to the story. I have been trying to find the document on the National Geographic web site but no luck so far. I will figure out a way.

By Marvin on Wednesday, April 24, 2002 - 10:48 pm: Edit

MikeV, can't the diagrams & maps be scanned?

By Davidtichbourne on Thursday, April 25, 2002 - 10:51 am: Edit

Bas,
Thanks, I emailed my coordinates too you.

YBs are, great last two days, (except for that starling that came into my loft yesterday)..

Trapping faster, and kit flying well, last two days, after about an hour of flying they land on the loft roof, landing board, deck and house roof, (I am tight on space and all the birds have to avoid huge trees, and a dozen wires.) and then hop right back in the loft, food or not....they don't fool around, many thru the trap at the same time, it makes my morning better as work is starting to pick up.

My biggest feed is in the late afternoon, but I ended up feeding a wee bit in the morning for now anyways...

later,

Dave.

By Oscar on Thursday, April 25, 2002 - 11:15 am: Edit

Hi Dave T. , I would recommend feeding once a day , only after their morning fly , you can feed them all they want then and still have no hugry birds and no problems trapping .

By Ran on Friday, April 26, 2002 - 04:41 am: Edit

Bas tryed to e-mail you but mail keeps being returned drop us another line will ya.
Regards Ran

By Davidtichbourne on Friday, April 26, 2002 - 09:48 am: Edit

Thanks Oscar, I will give that a try.

Dave

By Bas on Friday, April 26, 2002 - 07:52 pm: Edit

Hi Ran. Will do. Hotmail was playing up on either Wednesday or Thursday for me. Outlook Express is unstable for me on outgoing . Work/notwork etc. It's bloody had to find a good nerd these days to build me a decent email progam.Lol....Bas

By Bas on Friday, April 26, 2002 - 08:16 pm: Edit

Davidtichbourne,hi. Will send it Monday. Pleased to hear your birds are toeing the line. Didn't manage to ring that starling eh? Could have called him a cross couldn't you? ......Bas

By Davidtichbourne on Saturday, April 27, 2002 - 03:20 pm: Edit

Yes Bas, the birds are doing okay. It sure is fun to see the bird ranging around. I have alot of pieds and 5 whites so far, it looks great to see them fly around. I've trained myself to close my mouth to limit the drooling, but I am really gawking on the inside when I watch my birds...its the best part of the day...other than reading what the characters on this discussion site have to say...teehee.

It's amazing the number and different kinds of birds you see in the city if you get up early, all the songbirds are back now. The song birds are using my pigeon's feathers as stuffing for their nests they just love coming around to pick up the spare feathers.

I have another 15 young birds on the floor now, so next three weeks are going to be fun to get these guys outside slowly, and keep track of them all.

Thanks again for the magazine article here is another one I found on the kjsgroup...

http://www.smithsonianmag.si.edu/smithsonian/issues02/mar02/pigeons.html

later,
Dave.

By Bas on Saturday, April 27, 2002 - 09:18 pm: Edit

Davidtichbourne,hi.I'll check that site when I close here. Yes I haven't tired of watching them also. Kinda mellowed out the last few years. Never approached pigeons in a competitive racing sense. Really a means for breeding reliable sound birds. That was just where my interest lay. But I have been following the Yahoo's racing results and it has tweaked my interest. So who knows what is down the road. Getting a fairly good mental picture of guy's names, home areas, birds,preferences, etc. All magic stuff as local interaction is zip. Fear I've been posting too much . Eager beginner crap. Trying to draw my level guys on the side in. Aware of 6month expert syndrome. On the other hand, should stir the guns a bit to keep them on their toes.Lol...bas

By Bas on Saturday, April 27, 2002 - 09:35 pm: Edit

Davidtichbourne, Checked that site. Fair overall. May have trouble with 'Laserlike precision'. Know exactly how mine will react when I tell them. Some will roll their eyes up. Some will look down, mumbling and scuffing the ground with one foot. The others will just stand there, picking their nose and stareing off into space. And Bill S thinks he has trouble. Lol...bas

By jv (67.164.75.174 - 67.164.75.174) on Sunday, May 28, 2006 - 09:29 pm: Edit

hello guys, im flying dark this year. Well my question is has any of you loft fly twice while on this system? I darken the loft at 5pm and let them wake up to normal sunrise. thanks

By Roly (62.253.32.8 - 62.253.32.8) on Monday, May 29, 2006 - 07:15 am: Edit

You have it about right I guess. Me would be closed down at 4 : 30 and then when I get up like.
Couldn't care if they sun bathed all day till 4 : 30. In and fed and darkened easierly nough.

By Jimm (64.229.147.126 - 64.229.147.126) on Monday, May 29, 2006 - 07:45 am: Edit

Myself I look for about 7 hours of daylight??
Seems you might be a little long on getting them in the moult..Oscar I believe has a pretty good write up on his method.

By jv (67.164.75.174 - 67.164.75.174) on Monday, May 29, 2006 - 07:46 pm: Edit

Jimm, Ive been on the pipa site and the generalconcensus there seems to be 12 hours seem to be enough. Id like to confirm this hough as Ive read alot of where 16 hrs dark is needed. THe birds seem to be falling apart real nicely and wing is holding.

By Roly (62.253.32.8 - 62.253.32.8) on Monday, May 29, 2006 - 09:43 pm: Edit

Then it's working

By jv (67.164.75.174 - 67.164.75.174) on Monday, May 29, 2006 - 11:16 pm: Edit

roly, do you loft fly twice and feed twice a day? Id like to hear your thoughts on yb dark feeding regiment. thanks

By Roly (62.253.32.8 - 62.253.32.8) on Tuesday, May 30, 2006 - 07:01 am: Edit

Yes.... well when I went into it, I was given three good flyers system and how and why it works. The body moult is force through, and then it stops at the flights.
Darkess can be where there is just enough light to feed and water them selves... though dark like.
They can have light from 8 in the morning till 4 : 30 tea time. Out twice, or all day makes not a lot of difference. But most favour the tib - bit feed them in in the morning, and the controlled feed at night. Inside the loft has daylight till 4 : 30. The body moult fals to pieces, and then wing flights drop October / November or even later. Have been know not to drop till next season, all apparentley with no ill effects.

By jv (67.164.75.174 - 67.164.75.174) on Tuesday, May 30, 2006 - 10:36 am: Edit

thanks...for that tidbit. I do have a couple of birds right now that have dropped a flight.Mind u though that I did not place these birds right away in the dark. Some were close to two months before I implemented the system.They are around three weeks in the dark now at 12 hours a day. Should I be worried. Im kinda worried that the 12hour day not right and that and that they only need 8 hours. I just dont want this to backfire on me.

By Jimm (64.229.145.194 - 64.229.145.194) on Tuesday, May 30, 2006 - 11:32 am: Edit

As you said..they are falling apart..should be fine whatever time of darkness you are using.
Like you ..a few years ago had a young cock..won an open at the end of the season..had throwen his 6th or 7th..never was on darkening early..body was done and flights kept going..
Other birds were on their 2/3 flight..I do believe the body moult does take more out of them..my thoughts

By Connie (216.168.123.76 - 216.168.123.76) on Tuesday, May 30, 2006 - 11:49 am: Edit

This bird won the Combine with this wing. It was taken the day after the race. It was hatched in Jan with no darkening. I never would ship with the 7th flight gone my first year. I no longer worry if they are missing one flight as long as there is no huge space.

By Roly (62.253.32.8 - 62.253.32.8) on Tuesday, May 30, 2006 - 02:53 pm: Edit

Like I relate to. a woman due to have a kid gets a influx of andrenalin. usually waste it on 'Clearing up and clean the house from top to bottom lol, Likewise when in the moult, dropping flighs birds have the same.... it's nature's way I guess.

By jv (24.23.253.103 - 24.23.253.103) on Thursday, September 21, 2006 - 09:35 pm: Edit

hello folks, how do usually prep the ybs on basketing day? I mean how much would you feed the team for a 200 mile race? Ive been feeding my dark team 1.25 ounces a day feeding them all they want on thursday after their toss and about 0.5 ounces on day of basketing which is fiday? Birds seem to be doing great but a fellow club mate said they were a bit heavy. What do you lads think.

By Connie (216.168.102.10 - 216.168.102.10) on Friday, September 22, 2006 - 01:58 am: Edit

Hi JV,
I am a 'laddie' but here is what I do for my birds. It does not matter the distance to me on basketing day, they are always fed the same. (It is through the week that I do my major feeding changes.) Basketing day for me is...

all the medium size corn they want to eat,

then a mix of Austrialian Peas, Brown beans and Roasted Soya Beans, all they want to eat, (sometimes they eat none of this mix and I empty the trays again)

and then all they want of a good race mix with a handful of Hard Western Wheat thrown in.

I use the 'brick and feather' to judge how heavy they are. It seems to work fine.

By Roly (62.253.32.6 - 62.253.32.6) on Friday, September 22, 2006 - 07:06 am: Edit

That's scared him 'Coonie Catcher' lol! One must always bear in mind what YOU have in mind for the birds as regards feeding I feel. I have never seen a fat distance runner... well not one of note. But then again I have never seen a fat sprinter either... Muscular yes! So I ask 'What is the difference between y/b feeding, and old bird feeding. Young birds are still growing and developing, but just love to fly with the exuberance of youth. They should be flying just for the sheer hell of it. So it may well be a wider range of feed is required. I don’t believe you can give the birds, especially youngsters too wide a range feed wise.
I like a little feed with tib bits in morning to feed in… likewise at evening. BUT if I have time to, I prefer to feed in and place a spread in front of them by hand. When two or three have gone to drink I stop feeding. Next day the later ones trap quicker often. But I like to feel that their stomachs’ are nicely filled, with not too much to digest… as this means they will lose out on rest if they guts are still having to work overtime instead of being done and dusted.

By Jimm (64.229.8.203 - 64.229.8.203) on Friday, September 22, 2006 - 08:13 am: Edit

If your birds are doing well in the races..you are doing it right as far as feeding goes.
I can still remember a member telling me my birds were heavy..but that same bird beat him on the weekend..lol
I made it a point to mention I caugh that fat red cock bird..wether I did or not after that..lol
By your feeding jv it seems right to me..200 miles is a less than 5 hour fly..feed them up on the day after they get home..like you say they seem to be flying well..to me well is winning or placing well..not just coming home..if we are on the same wave length

By Connie (216.168.102.10 - 216.168.102.10) on Friday, September 22, 2006 - 10:10 am: Edit

"So I ask 'What is the difference between y/b feeding, and old bird feeding"

Reversing the order of feeds at the start and end of the week.

I think many make the mistake of treating their YBs as if they were OBs. Especially on their return from a race. My YBs get straight HW Wheat for their return, wereas my OBs get HW Wheat/ Barley/ lemon mix on return.

By Roly (62.253.32.6 - 62.253.32.6) on Friday, September 22, 2006 - 11:13 am: Edit

WHY?

By jv (24.23.253.103 - 24.23.253.103) on Friday, September 22, 2006 - 11:22 am: Edit

thanks for the advice guys. Although I havent won a first yet this year I have gotten the best returns placing well flying in the position I live in with a large handicap. Although I know this handicap is before me every week I just cant help but think that I may be doing something wrong. Being the only one flying dark system out of 10 guys I know I have a great advantage over them, but thye just have a fabulous spot right in the bowling alley of returns. If my birds come down their way I lose 25 minutes on average where I am only allowed the most a 5 mile overfly.

Roly, can you share with us how you feed on ship night?

Heres my feed schedule

Sat( Race return) My regular race mix
Sunday 100% Barley-all they want all day long
Monday 100% Barley-all they want all day long
Tuesday-wed Race mix 1.25 ounce
Thursday race mix with 10% safflower(all they want one sitting)
Friday 0.5 ounce per bird

One note on my race feed, Roly you mentioned a wide range is good for the birds which I initially had and was feeding this mix to the birds all week long but ever since my clubmate had mentioned the heaviness of the birds I have added 10% barley and other carbo loading grains like rice, sunflower seeds, to it and reverted to the feed schedule above. I may have had the protein level a bit high close to 15% therfor the change. I hope I didnt screw myself this week. Will let you all know.

Thanks for the help. Comments welcomed. Please!!!

By Roly (62.253.32.6 - 62.253.32.6) on Friday, September 22, 2006 - 11:54 am: Edit

I use to feed as they wanted... and leave the hopper in. Have a job to beat it, and will be reverting back to that next season.
The main difference is, as I see it, 1 prefers to hopper feed and they always knew there was feed there, and never found them to over eat or indulge.
Draw back... the only thing that I felt may be a draw back was they, on short races, is that they may not have trapped as fast as some would have liked, but a minute lost is nothing if the end product is better trained and trapping old birds.. I personally have always made sure I never rush any trapping, because I feel a bird can be ruined and by becoming trap shy. A few seconds space to alleviate any stress I believe pays dividends big time later... when it possibly is a far more needed time.
2. They don't know what you have in store for them.
So I'd put a little lemon juice on the feed, after it has been soaked for the extra distance.
They will partake of a lot more feed that way. It also means any feed they don't particularly like is ate too.
Y. B's only difference is 'Feed is for Learning'.
They need the Carbs etc. But they are growing, and quickly recuperate any excessive flying. Besides y/ b's aren't flying too far, so half ounce morning feed, and same at night if sure of early morning lib.
Distance I like a bit of fuel in their tank. And I believe whole heartedly that a bird that has strived the extra bit to get home, is peckish and WANTS to trap... provided you haven't scare the crap out of it the two previous weeks by rushing or badly handling it!
Sp basically I’ am not a great believer of leaving them short on grub to get them to trap quicker.
An ounce and a half average is fine if you hand feed or place before each day.
It is also ‘Habit’ forming. Like a tib bit… Every time they here a whistle and trap they get a peanut. So if always done, every time, hungry or not, they hear the whistle and trap. So why leave short… y/b’s need the extra because they exert themselves more, are growing… so if they are out flying, nipping here and there etc. Change the feed… and cut down a little, for over fed birds won’t fly … likewise hungry birds are looking to trap constantly, hence not really flying. A ounce and a half every day as a guide line…
Then they tell you more or less. If really circling well and you up it, and they slow down, revert back after leaving them a day in the loft.

By Roly (62.253.32.6 - 62.253.32.6) on Friday, September 22, 2006 - 11:58 am: Edit

Of course when 'Hopper feeding' one feeds different as the week progresses.
J.V. How did you darkness system work for you?

By jv (24.23.253.103 - 24.23.253.103) on Friday, September 22, 2006 - 05:01 pm: Edit

Roly, the dark has been good to me. Prfetty system to folllow and the birds have responded well. I like the idea where the birds dont have to face the handicap of moulting when racing has commenced.

I feed the birds once a day as well, all they wanted after their morning fly, whethere it be around the loft or training toss. I also believe that birds will only eat as they need, but after reading and talking to some folks this may not be true. Thats why I changed the feed up.

By Connie (216.168.102.10 - 216.168.102.10) on Friday, September 22, 2006 - 05:02 pm: Edit

Sunday 100% Barley-all they want all day long
Monday 100% Barley-all they want all day long

Young birds will give all they have to get home (if they are good ones). So they need to build their muscles back up immediately. Barley Sun and Monday would be better used for Wed and Thurs feeding. Just my opinion.

By Roly (62.253.32.6 - 62.253.32.6) on Friday, September 22, 2006 - 06:48 pm: Edit

Barley is great and has many good propties and benefits. too much can be poison. Known birds fly the distance on a high Barley content... But once toxined they are a year out at least...
Anyway the same for y/b's on return as old birds surely! Or do they come from another planet . Knew a couple of supposedly good knowledgeable ones trying to impress with that stupid old 'ChestNut' of 'Strains' 'needing so and so and such and such' ... the 'Have to train hard and feed heavy... 'Oh Kruaths!, no they don't take to wheat, or barly much for that matter' etc.
They are pigeons, and have the same digestive systems. And two or three peanuts after a race is good for ANY bird. If they have had an easy race I don't give them anything hardly except their normal feed etc. I may give ALL the birds a little LINSEED (fLAX) on a Saturday anyway.
Golly when the youngsters have been ranging(Roaming) and been away for yonks flying with zest, I never see or hear of any special feed being given when they return! But they have probably flown 2 or 3 times further that a lot of y/b races... the later one excepted of course.

By Bill (69.194.198.121 - 69.194.198.121) on Saturday, September 23, 2006 - 12:04 am: Edit

As you know my feed Roly they get the same feed seven days a week, if you expect them to perform you have to feed them the right amount and the best quality i only add a few peanut or safflower on wed or thurs then it same every day.
bill butterfield.

By JV (24.23.253.103 - 24.23.253.103) on Tuesday, September 26, 2006 - 08:52 pm: Edit

roly,

I did not understand your last post. Do you like barley in the feed. If so how much of it in the feed? How much and how often?

Last sat race went south again, out fifteen minutes, but dont mind much, it was like a training toss and was a trapping contest. speed was above 1500ypm. Great retuens and had 4 ina drop had all birds within 30 min.

By Roly (62.253.32.6 - 62.253.32.6) on Wednesday, September 27, 2006 - 06:38 am: Edit

Barley is great ... but not too much ... or indeed often.
Can cause toxins, which knock them sides ways if you (or them really) to get it.
But was a time, and many still do just feed Wheat and Barly in the winter months ti no ill effects.
Mote to it than meets the eye, so I am carefull with amounts now.

By Roly (62.253.32.6 - 62.253.32.6) on Wednesday, September 27, 2006 - 06:49 am: Edit

Mind they would have been sparingly fed. Or hopper fed which seems to have the effect of not being over fed.

By madrid (189.163.194.7 - 189.163.194.7) on Friday, October 19, 2007 - 05:33 pm: Edit

everybody speaks about feeding pigeon and i think is the most important thing for winning healthy pigeons but i haven`t seen any practical ration that i can use

could some body tell me a exact ration for feeding young pigeon at races

thank you

By Mikev (74.118.248.55 - 74.118.248.55) on Friday, October 19, 2007 - 08:25 pm: Edit

Hi Madrid

My advise is to buy a good commercial race mix from a reputable feed store.